Limbus company uptie 4 guide. Mirror Dungeon General Guide Guide/Tips Hello, Playing the game for quite a while, I now have gained a basic understanding of how Mirror Dungeon worked and wanted to share some tips. Limbus company uptie 4 guide

 
Mirror Dungeon General Guide Guide/Tips Hello, Playing the game for quite a while, I now have gained a basic understanding of how Mirror Dungeon worked and wanted to share some tipsLimbus company uptie 4 guide You can also try borrowing a level 30 uptie 3 ID from a friend, the Friend code thread is a good place to beef up your firend list, and some of the IDs like 7-Outis and R-Ish can be pretty useful for putting out blunt damage

The payoff is not worth: building a team around, using suboptimal skills, get right skill rng from teammates, get right rng speed order, pay health cost, just for a standard s3. 06. I will render them silent. Ineff. VincentVanFagoat • 2 mo. The game is based on their previous works, Library of Ruina and Lobotomy Corporation. 1 month bus transit pass: $85. They have a raincoat. In the combat phase, units on both sides will act. I have seen his S3 with 7+ coin power. Hurrah, justice hath arrived! I shall drive all villains into equal demise! –Don Quixote, Shi Assoc. You can expect an interesting combat system, weird lore, and a fairly high level of difficulty. Uptie 3 W Ryoshu is fine, but additional Coin Powers from Uptie 4, paired with +% damage bonuses on every single of her skills just simply makes her better at slashing through enemies. Use your noggin once in a while and it’ll do just fine. Limbus Company > General Discussions > Topic Details. ago. Help;. As the Executive Manager, lead your group of twelve Sinners, venture into the buried facilities of Lobotomy Corporation, and lay claim on the Golden Boughs. Unofficial fan subreddit for the mobile/Steam game Limbus Company. 93K subscribers Subscribe 368 12K views 3 weeks ago Disclaimer; if you have IDs you like using,. Here, we can see that Faust’s clash range should be 6-12, but it isn’t. 10 10 0:00 / 1:06:10 What IDs Are Worth Uptying to Tier 4? (Limbus Company Guide) Kaskozhuk 3. September 15, 2023 Cinq Association South Section 5 Director Don Quixote – Analysis Character Guides Guides Skills Overview Skill 1: A solid Lust skill with. He loses SP on losing clashes and on Uptie 4 his S1 also applies sinking on him on Clash Lost. Limbus Company is a gacha game where players are required to summon for their most wanted Identities and E. 600 shards and 1800 thread to uptie ONE 3* identity for each sinner 3240 shards and 4680 thread to uptie one of each rank (zayin/teth/he) EGO for each sinner. gg provides news, tier lists and detailed guides for Counter Side, NIKKE, Limbus Company, Eversoul, Archeland, Honkai: Star Rail and other gacha games. O::Spicebush](Tier III) Yi Sang - Crow’s Eye View(Tier III), Wishing Cairn(Tier III),. Contents: Victoria, BC, travel guide. G. The enemies seem to heal every turn too. All the fights seem to really benefit from bringing IDs that synergize the statuses the Refracted passive applies to, I picked +bleed and just. All those Identities work fine at Uptie 3, do not require Uptie 4 and because of that, using them at their full potential is faster. EXP Luxcavation #4, Thread Luxcavation #3 Added Season 3 Extractions As show in the image above, the following identities and E. O for the Abnormality Baba Yaga. While self-sufficient the tremor part is negligent and just serves as an enabler for the skills. On the left is a number ‘6’. Ish, W. This guide will focus on those. Limbus Company. And yep on hindsight I massively exaggerated the new Uptie per Canto part, the amount of work it takes for U4 alone is probably already astronomical. As the Executive Manager, lead your group of twelve Sinners, venture into the buried facilities of Lobotomy Corporation, and lay claim on the Golden Boughs. Limbus Company > General Discussions > Topic Details. This is meant to help make it easier. Date Posted: Aug 23 @. 1. 4th match flame has increased attack weight, which I am assuming means more attack targets. • Land of Illusion: Heals more SP in practice. I hope that when UT4 releases, you'll be able to see both tier 3 and tier 4 of an id or ego so that we can compare both tiers before extracting or sparking stuff that you don't have yet. Limbus Company. It will take time but it is doable. Essentially went for Terminus after losing Mersault to AEDD, picking the '25% heal all' gift and seeing if I could quit for a 3 Cycle win. He's like other tanks. Outside of N Corp team, she might struggle a bit. As the Executive Manager, lead your group of twelve Sinners, venture into the buried facilities of Lobotomy Corporation, and lay claim on the Golden Boughs. Limbus Company - A Combination of Turn-based RPG and Realtime BrawlEach turn results in a display of exhilarating action. 1 Sanity equals 1% chance increase / decrease. At Uptie Tier 3, skills. Outis is whatever, all her ids are average right now, may as well just keep her base. Slothful Gecko Feb 28 @ 11:18am. Class 3 Excision Staff Hong Lu – Analysis. Review. You do get a lot of benefit from it but she still kicks all the ass at uptie 3 as it is. And W Don has +coin power depending on charge while already generating a lot of it. Guide. Every skill in Limbus Company consists of at least one Coin. K Corp. This is the fight with the 4 security guards and I have no idea what I'm missing here. Also can fuel more of her own EGO. In order for your ranking to be included, you need to be. Home About the game Identities EGO Tier list Team builder Guides Blog Play on PC. They got pissed that a guy got a skin with an unbuttoned shirt while a girl has a full-on latex diving suit with no skin shown. (at least Uptie 1), Warp Don (Leap), G Corp Gregor (hack and Skill 3), L Corp Faust and as you said ammo characters are extremly good due to high burst turn 1/. Another reason to ignore high-star-characters is EGO system. 1. G. The twelve employees of the LCB (Limbus Company Bus) Branch of Limbus Company, and the main characters of the game. Because lots of Meta ID right now are already Powerful Enough in Uptie 3 that it just became waste of resources to Uptie 4 them. South Section 4. G. Tier 4: Decent. This is the first time a 000 rarity identity mirrored a common enemy instead of a named NPC or a boss. • Branch of Knowledge: gets an attack boost along with the heads SP loss. I've compiled just about as much information I could gather into one comprehensive guide, meant for new players who are confused and experienced players looking for niche advice alike. Kurokumo Clan Wakashu Ryōshū. South Section 5 Ishmael. G. Uptie your nuggets to level three asap. by (Wrath Reson. Everything you need in one place!Mirror Dungeon is a secondary game mode in which the player traverses a randomly generated dungeon with only a limited group of Sinners at their disposal to reach the end and claim its rewards. Limbus Company Beginner Ego-Shard Guide - RedditIf you are new to Limbus Company, you might be wondering what are ego-shards and how to use them. O::Spicebush] Yi SangDisclaimer. Guide says kill all 6 umbrellas in 1 turn. (Limbus Company General) vs SGG (Skullgirls General) highlights. 01 (KST)her uptie 4 is one of the few that actually make a meh unit good. Remnant) Don Quixote (Shi Section 5) Ryōshū (Kurokumo Wakashu) Meursault (Liu. G. Om3ga-Z3ro Jul 27 @ 2:47am. He loses SP on losing clashes and on Uptie 4 his S1 also applies sinking on him on Clash Lost. Description of the software and its. Passives. We are essentially paying for balance changes, it's not fair that some identities get a functional kit from the get-go while others need uptie IV to be functional. Uptie 4 is extremely exciting because all the different possibilities leave us with some real winners. Face the Fear, Save the EGO. The Identity story ends with Hook Office heading to the Library, leading to their Reception in Library of Ruina. That is a total of 3840 shards (roughly 2000 boxes, depending on RNG) and 6480 thread. As the Executive Manager, lead your group of twelve Sinners, venture into the buried facilities of Lobotomy Corporation, and lay claim on the Golden Boughs. Meursault. All Discussions Screenshots Artwork Broadcasts Videos News Guides Reviews. UT4 7 Yi Sang's S1 also gets effectively 14 (due to the -2 power on clash). Turns out Uptie 4 did kinda fix Poise lmaoTIMESTAMPS0:00 Explaining the. Limbus Company. O::Red Sheet in the alternate world. How the ♥♥♥♥ do I uptie things? Also how do I look at skills from the sinners tab in the main menu? How do I know that one thing is better with another thing? I literally can't even concider building a composition around something. If said ally is below 0 SP, further boost their Blunt damage the lower their SP is. I'm slowly making my way up to the third chapter. In the Lim-Bus. I think everybody will obviously prioritize #1, but between #2 and #3, which camp are you in? As for me, I'd sooner pick #2 over #3 and U4 R-Heath, whom I know I'm definitely going to use even if his U4 is meh, over BL Yi Sang, who really needs the U4. I just went thought MD2H with her and Zwei Gregor and she kinda. Unofficial fan subreddit for the mobile/Steam game Limbus Company. R Meursault contiues the trend of charge characters winning big. MrFox1231 Mar 16 @ 10:58am. in the alternate world, but not to any particular character. In the announcement, it said they will change that to 20 bexp (up to 3 times a week). #4. TheMetroGamer Sep 15 @ 3:18pm. We thoroughly research this information to ensure that we provide an authentic and honest list to help you make a. With the update on 20th of July, Uptie 4 has been released. As the Executive Manager, lead your group of twelve Sinners, venture into the buried facilities of Lobotomy Corporation, and lay claim on the Golden Boughs. [Effloresced E. 000 W meursalt still trash because you need skill 1, 1 coin to charge 6, lose clash. Uptie can be understood as Strength of the ID they “currently” have, if the ID in their own world become stronger, new uptie will pull in these new strength for the user to use. 1. R Ishmael does that AND deals more damage. uptie 4 is significantly more costly but generally is a very small, incremental improvement for strong units and a decent buff for weak units, but is quite expensive. . Trivia. Uptie Info. Your Friends Identity should show up here and will be of use to you. This update coming out this week + the ludicrous projected uptie costs is expediting this project though, since it's apparent not many players will be attaining this uptie tier anytime soon, and players not on the Day 1 or P2W Bandwagon will be hard-pressed to be as efficient as possible. Get 3 weeks of YouTube TV on us. . 4th Pack Rabbit — Gains 3 ammo at the start of the stage. #4. team comp: (all 00s are uptie 3, tingtang uptie 3)we get Uptie IV in a few days I quickly did the math on the Uptie Cost from ID+EGO III to ID IV for each character with every released ID+EGO (Feel free to correct me on my math). O. In our case, S is the best characters with D being the worst, and A, B, and C filling. Well my heart and the part of the brain that likes seeing big numbers when I attack the enemy. The highlights are: • What is Cast: Makes it easier for Rodya to max out her SP. Cloud Cutter's 'Before Attack' effect uses Coin 1 an additional time even if the first Coin 1 lost a clash. Community content is available under CC-BY-SA unless otherwise noted. Ishmael, LCB Sinner The skill 'Shield Bash' was previously named "Guard". Last edited by Minh ; Jul 17 @ 5:02am. G. in all areas the forest for the flames zayin ego is better than the red eyes teth. The Limbus Company EGO (ver. Limbus Company. About the Game. For the originated abnormality, see Drifting Fox. Reliable clasher and with a bit of. So a power of 5-14 with only 1 coin would always be either a 5 roll (tails) or 14 roll (heads). Gacha Guide; Battle Pass; Seasons; Status Effects; Community. Face the Fear, Save the EGO. Showing 1 - 7 of 7 comments. < 1 2 > Showing 1 - 15 of 27 comments The author of this thread has indicated that this post answers the original topic. )> uptie 4 your main team that you like to use ( make sure to pay attention to the uptie not every uptie 4 is relevant. Sinners, Identity and E. We will keep this list up to date with every character release and will rank them soon after. If Cloudburst is used multiple times in. limbus company already seems to be relying on the battlepass for it's money, alongside those who just want to get the. So converting shard now is a waste when you could have stack it for the ID you wanted and save Lunacy. G. When you cough up the resources to uptie 4 him, he practically will always be targets in a fight with his agro. Combined with the fact that he is fucking invincible and his good. The Sinners. Regular attacks target 1 slot. Was gonna weather the storm & make a Mirror Dungeon 2 Hard Mode Guide for the lesser-fortunate players. Lore-wise, the game takes place following events from both titles, and expands on the established backdrop of The City, its 26 Districts, and its. 1 ally with the least SP deals +10% Blunt damage. So a mixture of Ayin and Yesod I guess. Sensitive_Ant5312 • 4 mo. ) The second Uptie unlocks their third skill (-usually- the most powerful), provides a boost to the numbers on their first two skills (either base value - what you always get - or coin value - what you get added to base value if you flip heads) and another +1 to speed. Depending on the Coin's type, this may add to or subtract from the base power value. That 150% crit damage seems so stupid on blade sinclair. Odds are weighted in players favour when Sanity is above 0. Unofficial fan subreddit for the mobile/Steam game Limbus Company. Wiki rules; Wiki roles; Help;. Limbus has been far too easy for far too long. Download and install BlueStacks on your PC. ). 4th Pack Rabbit] Heathcliff & [The One Who Shall Grip] Sinclair will offer great damage and reliability, while others, while lagging a bit behind in the damage department, will still clash well and even offer other utilities, like [K. Trivia. R Mersault now gains loads of charge (and decent amount on W ID too) W Corp Faust now generates a lot of charge too, which makes her skills actually viable. Regular attacks target 1 slot. G. Limbus Company Wiki is a FANDOM Games Community. At 10+ charge his s3 also gets an absurd base total of 26 as well. . question about for anyone who has her uptie 4, does the on use poise potency on her s3 get added before it checks for. artemaffbe Feb 28 @ 8:07am. Timest. Coin Effect: [Heads Hit] > [On Hit] Inflict 1 Rupture [Heads Hit] Gain +2 Charge Count; Skill Power: 4 > 5;. Yes. Articles. clearly, the 4 extra doesn’t get rounded up. Face the Fear, Save the EGO. EXP Luxcavation #4, Thread Luxcavation #3 Added Season 3 Extractions As show in the image above, the following identities and E. Unofficial fan subreddit for the mobile/Steam game Limbus Company. so u can upgrade cliking in the + and tier is just at right. x2 If target previously took damage this turn, deal +30% damage If target previously took damage this turn, deal +30% damage43 (40+3) Atk Weight ⯀ Amt. Hired from a variety of backgrounds, the Sinners have all been hired for the. Big winner of Uptie 4 update. Showing 1 - 1 of 1 comments. Self-sufficient Charge Tremor unit that can work independently in any team. TIMESTAMPS0:00 Video Start0:49 Cinq Don Quixote ID Kit Review20:55 Patch Note Review28:07 Base EG. IS TIER IV. Gacha Guide; Battle Pass; Seasons; Status Effects; Community. Big winner of Uptie 4 update. Community content is available under CC-BY-SA unless otherwise noted. #3. A good basic flowchart. He is painfully aware that he is trapped in a cult, but he is too exhausted and overworked to do anything about it. View Mobile SiteSunshower. Crop units get very good amounts of value from Uptite 4. 1 ally with the least SP deals +10% Blunt damage. If you're looking for an easier way to browse the available IDs and EGOs, we've finished our initial work on adding them to our database - there's still some missing information, but it should be added there within the next few days. If you want to find the best identities to aim for, read on to find out! Limbus Company Tier List: Best Identities. #3. We will also be explaining the different types of systems set in place that might be confusing for a new player who’s not aware of the intricacies of such genre of games. 10 10 0:00 / 1:06:10 What IDs Are Worth Uptying to Tier 4? (Limbus Company Guide) Kaskozhuk 3. Uptie 4 did not help him much, outside of boosting his S2 when Heath is on -25 SP or lower. You're either going to be running Fluid Sac or Telepole+Representation Emitter, and either option benefits a lot from uptying. 4th Pack Rabbit] Heathcliff, [K Corp. The last Coin on the last skill in the chain deals +20% damage. O are all worth to Uptie 4 just because the increased attack weight This might have an impact on the upcoming Refraction Railway if PM increase the enemy numbers or skill slots. All Discussions Screenshots Artwork Broadcasts Videos News Guides Reviews. g. My first 5 upties are def deer ish, blade yi sang, blade sinclair, rhino salt and sadcliff. Her numbers being 10 (with 12 being a reasonable number to reach), 16 (19 possible), and 15 is really good, and puts her on a similar level as Chef Ryoshu for clashing. 25) rankings are on the top of the list and the worst rankings are on the bottom. Unofficial fan subreddit for the mobile/Steam game Limbus Company. Of those, only Hong Lu has Uptie 4, everyone else is Uptie 3. Help;. All the death flags were there, she practically stabbed herself with one with the "I can't wait to go back, maybe join the team, it's nice to have a home again" talk right before the final boss, and this is a PM game afterall. The other thing that needs uptie consideration is Faust's EGOs. Uptying is performed via the consumption of Threads, a resource explained later on. With the pace of new units being added to the game It's a treadmill i'm never going to win. O. Redesign sanity system and coin value, which you guys already failed to do once and rolled back. 1-1 was just a cutscene, also sorry about the low volume of the early videos. O will be removed from all Extractable item lists with the start of Season 3 (Excluding [Season 2] – Assured Extraction: 3* Identity Banners)A discussion about the current tier list of Limbus Company. 1. With his uptie 4, he can have 3 plus coin power. The OGsCompany)》已在2023年2月27日在Steam平台与各大手机应用商店(不包括中国区域)正式发售. The idea is to focus them down one at a time. #3. Another reason to ignore high-star-characters is EGO system. In the Season 2 announcement today, Uptie IV was revealed, costing additional thread as well as the Sinner's shards. Tier 4: Decent. Liker. O, the lower the probability of obtaining it. This is because the said dungeon is the best for Bongy Plush grind. Uptied, they'd have speed 4, 5 or 6. Unofficial fan subreddit for the mobile/Steam game Limbus Company. 93K subscribers Subscribe 368 12K views 3 weeks ago. Uptie Tier 4 Cost? What does everyone think of the cost for upgrading to tier 4? From the update note it seems it'll cost 50 egoshards and 150 Thread for a 3 Star. Denkiin202 • 1 day ago. If this unit fails to deal damage this turn, lose 15 SP at the end of the turn. If you uptie, you gain new skills and abilities. Her passive can be a good damage boost but sadly, it can be a bit harder than base Rodion’s passive and receiving 20% more damage might mean death, especially against enemies like in Mirror Dungeon 2 Hard. The third skill "Des Coups" translates to "hits". With the completion of chapter 2 every single of the default characters goes from a first thread to a third thread. solid numbers, solid gimmick of gaining shields when discarding as a tank, solid sin generation to support the archetype she fits into (sinking) I got it first pull with the extraction ticket from the attendance check. His death line also has him weakly call out for Catherine. Boatworks focuses on Tremor and Sinking. Ineff. Rip. Refraction Railway Stage Overview and Sub-120 Guide. UT4 does not make the difference between a win and a loss. 22 was implemented at two British Columbia Cancer centers. But to get them two seasons later you'll have to sacrifice your ability to get 25% of the new ones. Sinclair's Chatter #4 and 5 voicelines also reference his story and trauma. There's no point in spending this many resources on a character you never plan. Remnant Faust. Developed and published by Project Moon, Limbus Company is a turn-based RPG gacha game set in the same universe as Lobotomy Corporation and Library of Ruina. Unofficial fan subreddit for the mobile/Steam game Limbus Company. . After 2 weeks of lamenting, a 10,000 word script, and poring over Uptie 4 buffs, I can solidly say this is the best place to learn about these changes. All Discussions Screenshots Artwork Broadcasts Videos News Guides Reviews. Line 2 consists of a total of 9 different stations. Boatworks and Liu Ishmael both play very differently. Limbus Company > General Discussions > Topic Details. Her s1 now give charge on hit instead of on heads and both her s1 and s1 gain two more charge on use. [Effloresced E. The Coin Bonus applies when a Coin lands on Heads. Ishmael – Roseate Desire. All the sinners that utilize this E. Remember that you've got 80 more days before canto 5 and that the main bottleneck for UT4 are threads which you can get 27 of everyday from lux. NOT A SINGLE ID OR E. Click to install Limbus Company from the search results. The game was created by ProjectMoon. Limbus Company- A Combat Primer. 8. The One Who Shall Grip Sinclair. Gangleader UT4 only benefits with blood stack, which never happens unless you mix in N corp IDs. Don (Uptie 4) is primary damage dealer in most of the fight, due to abundance of pierce/slash and/or gloom vulnerable enemies. However, Uptie 4 is expensive in terms of thread and shards it requires. There are also seven sins that are elements, determined by the EGO your character wears. RedCobra Mar 23 @ 6:37am. I like Limbus as the Ruina for Idiots because I liked Ruina but got hard filtered by the last few bosses (I refuse to grind for cards and they lock your decks in the final gauntlet gg wp) but I know the Ruina gods are gonna get bored of it quick. This man has at least an effective hp of a thousand and also can gain a second life by using an ego. Still, seems a bit absurd for the price, also stronger corrosion is probably a bad thing for you most of the time. Beginner tips Beginner team ideas Updated Uptie 4 priority guide Generic Battle Effects Combat mechanics Gacha and monetization Refraction Railway Mirror Dungeon 2 Hard. 1. You need to use Counter or 3rd skills to gain self-afflicted sink which trigger passive buff which self-afflicted sink also reduce sanity to help you with coin toss result. Limbus Company /. That is a total of 3840 shards (roughly 2000 boxes, depending on RNG) and 6480 thread. As the Executive Manager, lead your group of twelve Sinners, venture into the buried facilities of Lobotomy Corporation, and lay claim on the Golden Boughs. they need money as they said before limbus was released to create their next game. South Section 4] Rodion. This guide will explain the basics of ego-shards, how to obtain them, and how to upgrade your identities and egos with them. Limbus Company Wiki is a FANDOM. The last god of Limbus Company is K corp Hong Lu at uptie 4. Right now if you full clear a MD, it gives you 7 bexp (up to 5 times a week). Manager Corporal Gregor is given the code ID “11203_Gregor_TommyAppearance”, suggesting that this identity mirrors the Tomah or “Tommy” that we see in Canto I’s story dungeon. Heck, there's barely that much incentive to buy anything past the (essentially seasonal) battle pass with Limbus Company unless you literally want every single ID, which you can still. In this guide, we talk about the uptie mechanic, which is necessary to defeat stronger opponents. G. Don Quixote's The Middle Little Sister identity mirrors a hybrid of the Stern and Sturdy Little Brother of the Middle in the alternate world. As for spending rolls to get Thread - don't bother. I prioritizing them more because they're just really Worth It to Uptie 4 (and i needed some tank in my team). 2) Check any skill - for example skill 3 of default Faust. Blade Lineage Sinclair, Yi Sang and Ishmael are the three 000 that gain the most power from uptie 3 to 4 hence my choices. Showing 1 - 1 of 1 comments. 6. Uptying is performed via the consumption of Threads, a resource explained later on. Wiki rules; Wiki roles; Help;. I've already uptie 4'd them and I really want to make them word for more "hardcore" content. {STEAM_CLAN_IMAGE}/43587230/a6483314d75d52efcf26b9564305d08fd02bdcff. There’s a lot more they could do by adding further Uptie levels. Shi Assoc. 06: Hong Lu // Cao Xueqin - Dream of the Red Chamber (also known as Story of the Stone) 07: Heathcliff // Emily Bronte - Wuthering Heights. THE biggest winner of Uptie 4 update. [Cinq Association South Section 5 Director] Don Quixote. Thus you get, for example, 35% of season 1 identities, but you've wasted resource from season 3 on that, so tou only get 15% of season 3. On the left is a number ‘6’. Spicebush, rabbit, chef and n corp faust are. Also, since the game's combat is pretty complicated, we're currently. The base sinners, think about it, they are extremely cheap so for every 1 uptie 4/000 you can buy 4 base sinners uptie 4. After 2 weeks of lamenting, a 10,000 word script, and poring over Uptie 4 buffs, I can solidly say this is the best place to learn about these changes. – Gain E. I found the overall quality of uptie 4 to be realy low. I've compiled just about as much information I could gather into one comprehensive guide, meant for new players who are confused and experienced players looking for niche advice alike. Another good ones are lob corp faust, n corp rodion and that pistol+shield ishmael. #5. monetarily this should in theory be decently good for project moon, since it makes the battlepass even more lucrative than it already is. G. All the powerhouses of the game in one team. Coin Power: +5 > +8. Video so long it might as well be a stream. I wonder if the rewards after weekly bonuses will be the same. So a power of 5-14 with only 1 coin would always be either a 5 roll (tails) or 14 roll (heads). 1) Smell the roses at Butchart Gardens. If an abno even dares to have multiple parts, not to mention human battles, they’ll be getting nuked twice as hard than they were before. Under perfect circumstances, his S1, Striker’s Stance, becomes the best clashing S1 in the game. Crazy stuff. Get Limbus Company here : Gacha Guide; Battle Pass; Seasons; Status Effects; Community. Pm would force you to uptie 4.